NetNews Offline 2/NetNews Offline Volume 2.iso/news/comp/lang/c++-part1/1298

Text File | 1996-08-06 | 4.2 KB | 92 lines

Newsgroups: comp.object,comp.software-eng,comp.lang.c++
Path: blackbush.xlink.net!slsv6bt!slsv6bt!kanze
From: [e-mail] (James Kanze US/ESC 60/3/141 #40763)
Subject: Re: Moving from C to C++
In-Reply-To: [e-mail]'s message of 10 Jan 96 02:40:13 -0500
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Sender: [e-mail]
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References: <4cs44p$[e-mail]> <[e-mail]>
    <1996Jan10.024013.8711@ohstpy>
Date: 10 Jan 1996 10:51:16 GMT

In article <1996Jan10.024013.8711@ohstpy>
[e-mail] writes:

|> In article <[e-mail]>, "David F. St.Clair" <[e-mail]> writes:
|> > Rocco Pochy wrote:
|> >
|> >> Our company is looking at moving toward C++ and the object-oriented
|> >> paradigm.  Unfortunately, the engineering staff is trained in C. Does
|> >> anybody have any experiences in moving from a structure C environment
|> >> to that of an object-oriented C++ environment?
|> >>
|> >> Is it better to ease everyone into using C++ as a better C and take
|> >> advantage of the encapsulation, getting people familar on the tools
|> >> before jumping into a full object-oriented development?  Or should
|> >> one jump right in a take the learning curve hit, sacrificing time to
|> >> market?

    [...]
|> > After around 3-6 months, get some formal OO training.  Suitcase the course in
|> > as well.  There are several good 5 day courses out there.  Include managers in the
|> > training classes.  Make a big production of training and stress the importance.
|> >

|> Treating OO like it's the 'chapter at the end of the book' is a waste of
|> their time. You must teach OO from the beginning.

|> C++ is a better C only to C programmers who refuse to change from
|> structures programming. If you C++ programmers, you are going to have to
|> teach OO from the first day. Anythig else is a waste of time.

Yes and no.  In my experience, the additional syntax in C++ can be a
real problem.  My own solution has been basically what was
recommended; first teach C++, and get people familiar with it, then
attact the OO issues.  The OO requires a totally new approach, and I
find it beneficial not to be able to teach it at a high level, without
having to hassle with all of the syntactical complexities of C++.

One could argue that this is a problem of C++; teach the OO in a
language that doesn't have so many syntactical complexities.  In my
experience, however, although C++ may be more complex than most, all
languages have some syntactic quirks.  And of course, once the OO
learned, it must be applied immediatly; the language used to teach it
must be one you are using in real applications.

In some ways, you might liken it to learning a foreign language.
Reading Racine is certainly a more significant activity than just
learning to decline a few French verbs.  But if you have to conciously
analyse each verb in Racine, you're not going to appreciate the
overall beauty of the play.  C++ is the verbal declinations, OO is the
literature.  (I suppose some would argue that learning C++ to do OO is
about like learning Russian to read Racine:-).  I'll make no comment
on that.)

    [...]
|> I programmed in C for years. It took me *one week* to learn C++ when thrown
|> into 50,000 lines of badly written C++ (written by C programmers who
|> tried to use some OO concepts) and asked to 'make it work'. I
|> did. I will never look back.

I think I came up to spead pretty quickly, too.  But there is a
difference between a way that is possible, and a way that works
generally for everyone.

|> > Look for evolutionary changes/benefits, not revolutionary.
|> >

|> Sorry, but C++ is revolutionary. C++ is NOT a better C and teaching this
|> to people on your payroll is a waste of money.

C++ is not revolutionary in itself.  The OO attitude is revolutionary.
Which is precisely why it is non-trivial, and why I find it useful to
get the low-level language details out of the way before presenting
it.
--
James Kanze         Tel.: [phone]        email: [e-mail]
GABI Software, Sarl., 8 rue des Francs-Bourgeois, F-67000 Strasbourg, France
Conseils, Θtudes et rΘalisations en logiciel orientΘ objet --
                -- A la recherche d'une activitΘ dans une region francophone